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Show I IE COM HEARING V AS T LYJMTER EST I N G 'Col.' Wall Says He Has Not Operated Railroads, but They Have Operated Him. RATES SHOULD BE EQUAL TO LARGE AND SMALL SH IPPBRS Mr. Griffin of the Freight Bu-reau Bu-reau Declares That No Pool-ing Pool-ing Exists Now. I The Joint Comtnitteo on Coal Short-nj;e Short-nj;e and Freight Discrimination hold another mooting in tho Mayor's office yesterday, commencing at 10 a. m. Two witnesses were examined. Col. E. A. Wall aud Charles H. Griffin, manager o tho LocaJ Utah Freight bureau. Ool. Wall was n Bleed about his crperienoe in shippping ore from Bingham to tho vnllo- smcltors. Col. Wall ropliod that lio had not shipped uny ore from Bingham Bing-ham during tho last two years. In the matter of coal, he said that coal had to be purchased from tho railroad company com-pany at n. cortnin rate per tou; it was so in tho purchase of lumber and tho like. Col. Wall said ho know tho rates on oro to the valley; that until recently the nominal rate was $2.75 per ton on ores having a value of less than $15 a ton. Freight rates are based on oro values. Ores oro shipped to tho valle' smelters for 50 eouts a ton. "Arc tho samo rates given to small as the large shippers?" was asked. "They are not. To small shippers they charge two or three times as much au to largo shippers. I mean by small shippors thoso miners who furnish ore in carload lots occasionally. There ought to be no difference. "Tdo not favor a maximum rate, but I boliovo that rates should be so adjusted ad-justed as to prevent discrimination be-twoon be-twoon parties. Tho small shipper should hnvo tho same rates as the large shipper. ship-per. Thoro should be the same rate for all; tho samo for one car as for ten, and tho rate should not be made dependent on value. Qf course, it is more profitable profit-able to the railroad company to ship in large quantities than to pick up cars hero and there. The discrimination which is made against small shippers of ore has a tendency to merge the mines ! thus operated into Inrgo companies. A maximum tariff would nor. bo a solution of the rnto problem in ore shipments. "With coal the conditions are different. dif-ferent. A maximum rate for coal transportation trans-portation could be established. The tariff, rates as established by railroads in this State as applied to the production produc-tion of mines are grossly unreasonable." unreasona-ble." Proposod Amendment, I Here tho Colonel read a written statement which ho had prepared. Tt is in the nature of an amendment to section sec-tion 455. Revised Statutes of Utah, t 1SP8. Under this amendment tho Colonel thought that the section above cited, relating to railroad freight rates, could be enforced. The proposed amendment reads as follows: And the offer for shipment in carload lots of any kind or class or material, product or commodity shall be deemed full compliance with all requirements as to circumstances, conditions and period of time as s-nld terms are employed in this section, and no portion of any commodity com-modity or product shall be subjected to a greater charge for transportation than any other portion of the same product or commodity by reason of Its greater Intrinsic In-trinsic or market value: provided, that Joss of mineral ores shipped loose or In null: by reason of unavoidable accidents may be at tho shipper's risk. If so provided pro-vided in the contract. "I. am not familiar with the conditions condi-tions upon which transportation rates aro based," said Col. Wall. "There ought not to be any discrimination against small irregular shinpers, because be-cause the real profit in the high-grado ore which they aro compelled to ship is small, on. account of the small seams or veins in which it is found. The general gen-eral purpose is to fix and exact a rato lor all the product will stand." T,1,e0,.onel as cross-examined by P. L. Williams, general attorney of tho Snort. Lino, but nothing further of value to tho committee was brought "u Mr- Williams asked tho Colonel it be had ever operated a railroad. Tho Colonel promptly replied that he had not, but that he had been operated Jbv tho railroals. I Mr. Griffin's Testimony. C. II. Griffin, in response to questions ques-tions put to him by Mr. Lawrence, said tnat he was the .joint agent for tho various va-rious railroads; had supervision of the TJublicataon of freight tarifTs of ail the lines in Utah. "I do not make rates " The association was a joint agency and was not authorized to make rates "It wan my duty to publish tho rates and have the same filed with the Interstate Commerce commission. This joint agency waa in existence for several years, out was disbanded on the 6th of icbruary. This wis because they Jiught. havo received word from their legal departments that the association did not conform to the statutes of the btate. rhoy are now doing business' tne witness said, aa the Local Utah' .Freight bureau. At tor disclaiming that there was any pool in the joint association, the witness wit-ness said that the object of the bureau ?hp0r3.PreV crimination against The witness was asked a great many questions respecting the posting o'f rates by the several railroad liu?s; ho disclaimed any knowledge of pooW rates by any lines in this State. Ho did explain tho method of .poolintr but eaid nothing of the kind was contfcWl by tho railroad lines in Utah The witness will appenr for further I examination before the commission today to-day at 1:30 p. m. |