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Show NINE PERSONS ARE SLAIN IN POSSE CLASH WITH NEGROES Head of Steel Corporation Corpora-tion Testifies in Investigation Inves-tigation by Senators of Causes of Dispute. Declares Union Control of Industry Means Decay; De-cay; Denies Charges Made by Gompers. WA.SHI.NUTOX, Oct. 1. Declaring that the question of the open shop the right of a man to work, irrespective of whether he was a member of a labor union was the solo issue in the nation-v. nation-v. idc steel strike. Judge Elbert H. liarv, chairman of the board of the Tailed Slates Sled . corporation, told ;t!v senate investigating committee today to-day that his corporation would never jield. Even now, he said, the strike is failing. "There was no reason for this strike." said Judge Clary. "The men did not want il. It w-as forced on them from the outside, by the organisers of labor unions. The open shop is the question here the right to bring about fullest production with only the interests inter-ests of the employee, the employer and the public in sight." Labor leaders, he told the committee, commit-tee, were seeking to unionize all industry in-dustry in the country. Should their efforts be successful, he asserted, industrial indus-trial decay would follow. "It means the condition I fear England En-gland is in today," he added, "though I have hopes she will come out of it.,; GARY WILL RESUME HIS EVIDENCE TODAY. Judgo Gary had not concluded his testimony tonight and will be examined exam-ined again tomorrow. He gave way for an hour today to several employees of the corporation's mills, who told the committee they knew of no reason for the strike. All agreed that the men who voluntarily responded to the strike call were mostly foreigners, and one of them John J. Martin, a Youngstown machinist, attacked the leaders of the Xational Steel Workers' committee. "I think John Fitzpatrick (chairman of the workers' committee), with William Wil-liam Z. Foster (secretary of the com- (Continued on Page 9, Column 1.) ! JUDGE GARY GRILLED BY imquisiTDRS (Continued From Page One.) mitteo), as an able assistant, head a band of buccaneers who will overthrow over-throw this government if they are not stopped," said Martin, who explained that he himself formerly was a union man. They were engaged, he said, in "scuttling the American Federation of Labor. ' ' Martin testified that the steel employees em-ployees at Youngstown, "American and foreigners alike,'' had been "terrorized by threats to burn houses and kill children.-' Judge Gary also said in the course of his testimony that the com-! com-! pany had much "hearsay evidence" j that such throats had been made against I men who would not join in the strike. REVIEWS CONDITIONS ,.. LEADING TO STRIKE. I" the course of his testimony, .,-'". ' Judge Gary reviewed conditions leading f up to the strike, and discussed at length his refusal to meet the w-orkers' national na-tional committee. To have negotiated with the committee, he said, would have been a departure from the company's policy to treat directly with its employees em-ployees and would have damaged the prestige of tho open shop policy. Discussing this point with Senator Borah, Republican of Idaho, he said conditions con-ditions might arise under which he might, talk with union leaders not employed em-ployed by the company. "Provided they said fairly that they represented 15 per cent of the men employed, em-ployed, for instance," he said, "I might discuss the wishes of that 15 per cent with them." Mr. Gary brushed aside the charges of union leaders that the corporation had mistreated its men, with the statement state-ment that in no basic industry in the world were the men better treated or paid higher wages. Later he went into the welfare work of the company among its employees and presented figures to show that employees generally received approximately three times as much now as they did in 1914. REFUSED TO DISCUSS PRESIDENT'S EFFORTS. Although pressed by Senator Kenyon, chairman of the investigating committee, commit-tee, Mr. Gary refused to discuss the efforts by President Wilson to bring about an understanding between the corporation officials and the union leaders and avert the strike. 'jX "When the president communicates l .- with a private citizen," he said, "it is not courtesy for the .person so ap-(..-' proached to say what the communication communica-tion was." I Eeverting at the end of the dav to his general view of the situation, Judge Gary said: "The general public now requires increased in-creased production. That may even necessitate increased hours, up to the limit set by the willingness of workers and their health. But there is no use of talking about increased wrages and decreased production and at the same time roaring about rising prices. I'm . in favor of high wages, but there comes a time when there is a limit. "In my view, prices are too high right now. The right way to do is to lower them first, and decrease wages last. That is the policy of the steel industry. " DENIES REPORT OF MEN'S MISTREATMENT. Denying that the steel corporation had . mistreated its men, aa charged bv union i labor leaders. Judge Gary said that, in his opinion, there was no basic industrv in the world which had paid larger wage's than his company. "It has been charged that during the rending strike, the subsidiary companies have been guilty of attacking and mis- Urating employees,'' said Mr. Gary. ! "There isn't a vestige of truth in that statement. 1'holograplis were displayed here and it was said a woman was killed. I This photograph has been posted all over America, with u line over it. 'Mrs. Fannie SeUens' Body Ghoulishly Mistreated by j the Steel Trust's Fiendish Crew.' i "She was shot at Biackenridge, Pa. We have no works there, no men there. If she was killed, it was without even the knowledge of the steel corporation ; or any of its employees." j No Responsibility. "Hasn't your company investigated that matter, in view of tho charge?" asked Chairman Kenyon. j "The verdict of the coroner's jury," , said the witness, "made it certain that no agent of ours had t lie remotest connection con-nection with her death.." "I have the certilled copy of that verdict," ver-dict," said Senator L'hups, Republican, Colorado. "I'll file that." "We have 'discussed the Incident with j some of our people," Judge Gary resumed, ! "not because we thought they might be guilty, but for infoi mal ion. Our orders and our policy aie against any aciivity which could 'lead to any thing of that kind." H. V. Lindabury, counsel for the cor-poration, cor-poration, said the woman was killed dur-i ing a strike of coal mmers. Judge Gary; saTd, in his opinion, the ".shot probably; was' fired bv the strikers themselves." ! He added" that his company had no in-1 terest in the coal mines where the riot occurred. Senator Phipps read a certi- . fied copy of the inquest record in the case. The jury's verdict said the killing was by persons unknown and that tho deputy" sheriffs involved were firing In self-defense. Deputies on Payroll. j Chairman Kenyon asked whether deputy dep-uty sheriffs were sworn in at the corporation's cor-poration's plants and were on the company's com-pany's payroll. : "I should say yes," said Mr. Gary.. So far as I know, they have had nothing to do with any of these outbreaks," He added that it was possible that some of the company's guards had participated par-ticipated in disturbances since the steel strike began, but pointed out that Mrs. Sellens was killed before the strike started. Referring to testimony of President Gompers of the American Federation of Labor, that Jefferson D. Pierce, a union organizer, had been beaten by company agents while attempting - to organize unions in the steel mills and died from Injuries, Judge Gary read an affidavit which he said had been sent to his office on September 27 by Pierce's son. "I was with my father the night he received his injuries," said the affidavit, "and he said they were not caused by any agents of the" steel corporation." "He was injured by a member of the I. W. W. faction, which was endeavoring to gain control of the organization. i wish to refute most emphatically the charge of Mr. Gompers that his death was caused by any agent of the United States Steel corporation. He died one year later of cancer resulting from the wound." Answers Fitzpatrick. Judge Gary then took up the statement of John Fitzpatrick, chairman of the steel strikers' committee, that men had been killed at Hammond, Ind., during the steel strike. ,rWe have no connection with the Standard Steel company there," he said, "and had no connection with the Incident." Inci-dent." "This strike has been conducted In many respects like other strikes," Mr. Gary continued. "The large majority of our workmen were not desirous of engaging engag-ing in a strike. They were not members of any labor union, having declined to I become such year after year. "Throughout the war our workmen were loyal. While it is true that there is a radical element of foreigners at the present time, it is only doing justice to say that, In my opinion, the majority of the foreigners were good citizens." "Do you mean by 'foreigners' those not naturalized?" asked Chairman Kenyon. Ken-yon. "I include all foreign-born." "What proportion of men of foreign birth have you?" asked Mr. Kenyon, "I cannot give you that now, DUt will j later," said Mr. Gary. Men Not Responsible, "The men did not strike of their own volition," he continued. "They were taken out by the constant effort of union leaders. Threats had been made we have a great deal of hearsay testimony that families were told their children would be killed, their houses burned. If tho men didn't go out. Large numbers of men remained away from work because be-cause they were afraid. "If you exclude these, who did not think there was sufficient protection, 1 think it Is fair to say that not over 28 per cent of our employees struck. If you include them, the total away from work was about 40 per cent." Judge Gary said the men were returning return-ing to work. "More returned yesterday rceeivod them as representiitives of tluit 15 rov cc nt. I "It was claimed here that you havo appropriated larne sums to fight labor unions," Senator Phipps remarked. "We've never set aside one penny for that purpose," said Jude Gary. Replying to questions by Senator Walsh, the witness said he would not deny that labor unions might bo good things in j places arid at times, but that "universal practices of labor unions carried to the ; extent which permits outside agitators I to establish tho closed shop universally ! are inimical to the best interests of tho employees and the general public." j An Emphatic Denial. j Senator Walsh asked whether labor or- i ganizatlons had not secured great reforms re-forms in working conditions, wages and the like. "I deny that most emphatically," said Judge Gary. "The corporation has been in the van all the time in that respect." "Do you mean to say that the steel In-1 In-1 dustry led the country in the eight-hour day?" asked Chairman Kenyon. "I did not say we had adopted the eight-hour day," Judge Gary replied. "That has been largely a question of desire de-sire on the part of the employees. It involves in-volves the question of compensation. "I think a large portion of the public believes in the eight-hour day, on the : ground that that's long enough for a man to work. We're very carefully considering consider-ing tho question. As a matter of policy and principle, if we can make it practicable prac-ticable to adopt eight hours through our work universally and the men are willing to accept that, v. o will be very glad to adopt It." "Then you take public sentiment into consideration in this controversy," Senator Sen-ator Kenyon continued. "Whom do you recognize as representing1 the public the president?" Reply Causes Laughter. The committee and spectators laughed when Judge Gary replied: "Well, you know there are two parties. One party claims the president does and the other that he does not. I have very great respect for the president myself." Chairman Kenyon pressed Judge Gary regarding testimony before the committee that President Wilson had requested him to receive the strike committee. "Don't you think you ought to get an answer to that question from him?" Mr. Gary demurred. "If I had I wouldn't have asked it," Senator Kenyon said. "Do you decline to state whether the president wrote you to that effect?" "If you insist, no," Judge Gary replied, re-plied, "but I think you ought not to ask the question." Continuing, Judge Gary said he thought sentiment was largely against the closed shop, and for the open shop principle. "I agree with, you," said Chairman Kenyon. Senator Kenyon again questioned the witness about the report that President Wilson had requested him to receive the strike committee. At the request of R. V. Lindabury. counsel of the corporation, several stpel mill employees who accompanied Judge Gary to Washington testified before Judge Gary resumed. Roller Is Witness. "William Rumberger, a roller from New Castle, Pa., said the strike had affected only unskilled labor, chiefly foreigners. He said conditions in the mills were good; the men were satisfied and had no desire to go out. "Do you know of any Bolshevistic propaganda among1 foreigners in your mill?" asked Senator Kenyon. "None I know of," the witness said. Rumberger said he was a deputy sheriff, having been given that authority since the strike, and that about 100 of the employees em-ployees had been deputized at the plant. James Sinclair of Duquesne. Pa., said he was a heater at the Duquesne steel works, where 5000 men were employed before the strike. His own wages, he said, averaged $12 a day. "How many men have gone out there?" asked Chairman Kenyon. "Not 5 per cent," Sinclair said. "What reason did they give for going out?" "I really don't know. The men were satisfied. Some went out and came back after two or three days. They told me they were afraid of the strikers." Most Strikers Foreigners. John J. Martin of Youngstown, Ohio, said the largest proportion of strikers were foreigners. "The Americans held a meeting dav before yesterday." he said, "and we voted unanimously against affiliating with union organizations." Half of the men employed had gone out, he said, "after great intimidation," and others had gone when the plants were unable to work. "These peoDle have carried out a system sys-tem of intimidation that Is thoroughly un-American," un-American," he asserted. "They mass at the doors of the plant, threaten to burn down our houses and kill our children. "I don't think, from my knowledge of the American Federation of Labor, that these strike organizations represent the federation of labor. "I'm positive, from talking with those foreigners, that they don't know what the twelve grievances are," Martin said. "The reason most of them are in the unions is because Americans were not asked to Join. I think somebody's got in and scuttled the American Federation of Labor." "Who's doing the scuttling?" asked Senator McKellar. "I think John Fitzpatrick, ably seconded second-ed by W. Z. Foster, is the 'king bee' in the scuttling," Martin said, "and that they are heading a band of buccaneers who will, . if they are not stopped, succeed suc-ceed in overthrowing the American government. gov-ernment. "If I had my way I'd pick Mr. Foster and some of these monomaniacs up and have them examined. The American Federation Fed-eration of Labor has always conducted constructive strikes. This outbreak is purely destructive, to break things up." Gary Resumes Stand. Resuming the stand late in the day, Judge Gary said the steel corporation had expended $32,000,000 in houses not yet completed. "On our rented houses," he said, "the rent has not been increased since 1914. Since 1912 we have paid out for welfare work $65,700,000." Judge Gary added that during the same period the company had built forty-seven forty-seven schools and twenty-three churches. Stock in the company, he said, is now owned by 61,000 employees. "I don't think the labor unions are one-tenth one-tenth as Interested in the welfare of our men as we are," said Judge Gary. I than on any day since it staged," he said. i Senator McKellar, Democrat, Tennes-j Tennes-j see, said It was contended that the hours ! of labor In the steel mills were unusually long. "I want to refer to wages first, said Judge Gary. "The lowest wage rates paid by the corporation to unskilled labor, la-bor, working ten hours a day, are 42 cents per hours in our basic eight-hour-day plan 12 cents per hour for ten hours and for tho hours over eight time and a half is paid. That Is at a rate of 63 cents an hour, making $4.62 per day. High Earnings for Some. "That is the cheapest pay for men. Some boys may get $3 a day. ".The highest earnings, of rollers, are S32.5t per day. They roll the hot metal into sheets." "Is that the average pay to the rollers?" roll-ers?" asked Senator Kenyon. 'No, that is the highest," said Mr. Gary. "The general average wage of all manufacturing plants, not including executives, ex-ecutives, administrators and salesmen, on Julv l, PU9, was $6.27 per day." He explained that some men work eight, some ten and some twelve hours a day. Men are permitted to work only eight hours, he said, when the labor is unusually hard. "This question of hours is Important," he observed, "and I desire to go into it fully later." The present average wage of unskilled laborers ot tho corporation, the witness said, is $5 per day, and of the skilled $6.70. "Under the open shop practice," he said, "the man is treated according to his merits." t Quotes Pay Figures. Judge Gary said 69,284 of the corporation's corpora-tion's employees worked a twelve-hour day. 199.S96 a ten-hour day, and that SS,90 J averaged an eight-hour day. The witness said the general average of wages in manufacturing plants of the corporation was $2.93 In 1914 and $6.27 In 1919. In the coal and coke works, the average in 1914 was $2.74, and in 1919, $5.20; in the iron ore works the averages were $2.75 and $5.70, while in the corporation's cor-poration's shipbuilding yards this year the average was $5.53. In transportation work of the corporation, he said, the 1914 rate was $2.71, against $5.02 this year. Miscellaneous employees received $2.26 in 1914 and $4.48 this year. "How much do you pay superintendents?" superintend-ents?" asked Senator Kenyon. "As high as $7000 or $S000 a year." "How many rollers have you at $32 a day?" "I believe there's only one, but there are many at $29, $28 and $27 a day." "Ten or twelve?" "Oh, more than that." "Is it not the fact that up-to-date rolling roll-ing mills are automatic?" Senator Phipps inherposed, "and that the roller's main duty is to know that his rolls are properly adjusted?" "You're right," said Judge Gary. "The high pay is for his skill. None of these men performs manual labor. He touches a button or pulls a lever." "What we'd like to know Is what caused this strike," interrupted Senator "Walsh, Democrat, Massachusetts. Judge Gary's Retort. "Judge Gary, Mr. Gompers and Mr. Fitzpatrick told us the cause of this strike was your refusal to meet the men's committee" Senator Kenyon said. "That ! ought to bring us to the point." ' "They ought to know, they called it," j Judge Gary retorted. "There was no reason rea-son for this strike. The men didn't want it. It was the union leaders who wanted ' the strike." "Do you know the men were satisfied?" asked Senator Johnson, Republican, South Dakota. "Tou were not in the mills, i among the men, were you?" "They have told the officers of our corporation cor-poration so," Judge Gary said. "Our fore- i men and superintendents know it. Our i men are able to come to foremen and superintendents at any time to make i complaints and get adjustment. They i can even come before the chairman of the board if they desire. It Is always our practice, and they know how the men feel." Senator Walsh asked If Mr. Gary knew the men would strike if the leaders were not received by him as they requested. "I didn't. It didn't occur to me," said Judge Gary. "Was there any other reason for your refusal to see the union leaders?" Senator Walsh pressed. After a pause Judge Gary replied: Outlines His Attitude. "Senator, I want to be frank enough to say that it has been my policy and the ' policy of the corporation not to deal with union labor leaders at any time. If an , employer contracts with union labor lead- , ers he will immediately drive all of his employees Into the unions, otherwise they could not get employment. "I'm not saying that they have not a perfect right to belong to a union. But we are not obliged to contract with them if we think that union is not a good thing either for the employee or the employer." Senator Walsh asked whether his position posi-tion was not practically notice "to the employees em-ployees that the corporation was opposed to organization of unions." T cannot concede that," said Judge Gary. "If they had nothing to do with your affairs, how could union chiefs get your men to strike?" Senator Walsh asked. "I can answer that," Judge Gary returned. re-turned. Forced Out by Strike. "They had about 10 per cent of our men In organizations, but they could not even depend on that number. They said here, that they did not dare wait, in response to the president's request, or that small number would have left their organization. When the strike was called, a considerable number of others were forced out too. "This whole thing comes down to a question of unionism," Judge Gary pounded the table, "to a question of the open shop; we stand for that." "I saw a statement that you could not arbitrate this question," Senator Borah, Idaho, interrupted, "because there was a moral Issue involved. The whole country is interested in knowing what you consider that Issue, so fundamental, to be." "Senator, the open shop Is the question," ques-tion," Judge Gary responded, "the right of a man to work whether he belongs to a union or not the right of an employer em-ployer to employ a man, whether he belongs be-longs to a union or not. Thinks It Immoral. "I think it's immoral for a small minority min-ority of organized men to force a large majority to yield to their wishes. If unions control industries in this country, it means decay, the dropping of production. produc-tion. It means this country can not keep up in the race with the world. It means the condition I fear England is in today." "It seems to me that you are on the defensive," Senator Walsh interrupted, "because you did not see the committee and let the issue be raised." "I would like to tell you what I believe to be the undesirablllty of conferring with labor leaders," Mr. Gary continued. "Some time ago Mr. Ttghe (president of the Iron, Steel and Tin Workers' union) wrote me, asking to negotiate a question. I wrote him It was against our policy. In a public meeting later he stated that he was in correspondence with me on labor matters. "The effect of that, I think, was bad on the minds of our men. I think some joined the unions on the report that we had changed our policy. They all have known all the time," Judge Gary continued, con-tinued, "that we did not negotiate with union leaders. Thjs Is no new thing." Reiterates His Position. "Is a conference recognition of the unions?" asks Mr. Kenyon. "Yes," was the reply. "They wrote me, giving the names of their unions. They said they wanted to discuss things relating relat-ing to our men. That was not fair to our men. I must bo fair to the men who are opposed, decidedly, to unions." "Then this resolves itself into the , statement that you do not propose to deal with union leaders because you feel that would destroy the whole principle of the open shop?" asked Senator Borah. "Yes, that is it In a nutshell." Tf the labor leaders had come to him. paying they represented 15 per cent of tiie compa r;''s men, Judge Gary said he would not ay that he would not have |
