Show REMARKS on the redemption of zion lon second coming of christ trials of the saints etc by elder orson pratt in the tabernacles tabernacle G S L city sunday morning mornin mai may 20 1855 REPORTED BY J V LONG I 1 have been much interested in the remarks that have been made by br jackman for they have been bean according t to my feelings they were right to the point and many useful ideas have been thrown out before us and his words have been full fall of meaning although he has considered himself bashful before the 11 people yet the lord has put into his heart those things that are calculated to interest the saints we see from what has been portrayed before us the trials and difficulties that we some of us have had to endure in this church we also see from what he has explained the patience of the people in passing through those difficult ties no murmuring no complaining no faultfinding lin rin ding but all taking hold with one heart and one mind to do the will of god under the most straightened circumstances we WT can contrast this feeling with what we see manifested by some of our new emigrants some of them come in here feeling dissatisfied having become so in crossing the plains they will differ with each other lose the good spirit and allow themselves to be controlled by an evil influence I 1 say we can see from the ais als discourse course of br jackman Jac krman kroan a great contrast between those that first came here and those that now come now the question might arise in the minds of somewhere some were the pioneers who came here so much better than those persons that now come I 1 think not then why was there no murmur ingnor fault fi finc neing ing nor apostasy apo stacy stac the reason is obvious those who first came cams here had more experience in such matters than the new emigrants have who come here almost without experience in those things which they naturally come in contact with when crossing th the plains in fact there are very few in the world that would do any better than the mormon pioneers did the first year they came here bete it requires I 1 experience to enable people patiently to pass i through the scenes of trial that were endured by I 1 the pioneers and those who first came into these valleys take our late emigration that have cf ossed crossed over the plains and let them be driven a few times limes from arom their comfortable habitations hand rand andlee let them wander for months in the cold winter and then tilen send them off odd on an expedition such tg tte the pioneers took goolt to this country r nd aoa would see them quite a dlf dif derent different r people you yoa would see them altered rind nd improved by the course couise of experience they had passed they would be benefited by certain kinds of ex peri ence which wh ch others have passed through before them and ind if attentive they would add many important items to their former stock of wisdom and knowledge consequently it requires i ires exper experience lence not only for the old members but for the new and should the new members embers in be permitted to come from the old countries and meet with no poverty no affliction it would not be known whether those persons would endure euch such trials and hence the necessity of such trials to give people experience peri ence it is true they have had some things to pass through th in the old country of a trying nature but they have not had a series of different trials to encounter therefore there would be no telling whether they would stand or not if called to pass through similar scenes seanes of trials to those passed through by the earlier settlers orthis territory than then it is not surprising to me that the lord takes certain measures to bring those persons I 1 into difficult cincu instances A we have the lords awn ow declaration for r he w ill ili try this people peole khot shot hot in some thin abut in in all things wings to see gee athey if they will abide in in the covenant and he says saya if they will not then they will not abid abil iame in me here then we perceive that each will haye have his share of trials either in in the beginning 0 or in in the advanced state of the church we do not know what they will be only so far as god has hab ha reve revealed aled alee in his word t he lie has told us that we should be visited with famine and sword swords with pestilence and distress all ahse are predicted and laid before this people in the book of doctrines and covenants the lord says unless his servants should hearken to the words and counsels that he gives unto them famine trouble and distress would overtake them now what benefit or what glory is there to ta an individual who is is placed in circumstances that he cannot help but do right for instance suppose there were no intoxication drinks in in the tiie world what glory and credit woula would it be to in an individual to say that he had kept himself from those things if his father and his forefathers to t the abid third or fourth generation of them had died from drunkenness he would have nothing to boast of for he could not be a drunkard therefore I 1 J say if this temptation was set before us as the forbidden tree was before mother eve and we withstood tile the temptation then there would be some merit in in it far ar more than there is for a person to keep himself sobe sober because he be is obliged to do BO so we may tak tah take tahe other eother things in in the same light why did the lord suffer the hittites Hitt ites and Peri Pen and hiviles Ili Hi vites and Jehu and various others to live among israel lie he had hid two purposes in view one was to scourge scourge israel when they went astray from his commandments and the other was to see whether they would overcome or not he be placed them where they would have temptations to test their fidelity then if directly in the face of the law of god gods they would falter or yield and give way to the customs and vices of the heathen they were ilot not worthy of tile the glory of god nor of being called his 1110 people but if the heathen had bad all been swept aw away a and those temptations had not been presented where would have been the merit it would have been very small indeed A commandment was given forbidding the children of israel to marry with the heathen sl was commanded that tile the sons gons of israel should not take wives from among the heathen neither should they give their daughters to the heathen now there was temptation in those days sel eel before the th children I 1 idren of israel and sometimes they would break through and go beyond the bounds like old uld solomon who transgressed after god had appeared to him three times limes and had bad given him many choice favors and ted himself 0 to o him in dreams and also when he be spread forth his hands to pray god to temple which he had built then the lord manifested himself in the presence ol 01 all israel to h ha servant 0 lie he was lifted up in the midst of israel anda and a kingdom and government were given to him hini far fir surpassing ill iii all III the kingdoms and governments gowern gofern ments upon theearta the earth and yet after all these thi tunings rigs and after the lord had given him many wives he be took that which was forbidden he took the daughters ol 01 the heathen nations and he being their head and their king set this wicked this evil example before all israelson Isra elso eiso that if they had followed his foolish and wicked ways they would have been destroyed but from the account we have hs he was overcome by the tempha lions laid before him and consequently the wives that he be had taken led him much so that tat in his old age he in order to please those wives whom he had taken from among the gentiles gentil esy est bowed down to their gods liere here I 1 then h e were two evils first in taking heathen w wives i asand and the net nest in in tampering with land band land bowing down to their gods gode and the uie lord will judge him for all those th things inIs just as he will us according ding to the works we nye perform while in this I 1 state t t e of probation if solomon in all his glory had been acon contented with all those blessings given him and had not yielded to the temptations laid to en snare him he be would have increased in his glory I 1 and in his dominions his fils would have in creased in this world and in the future but the th e j lord desired to try him I 1 I 1 this shows us that thou though h a man may be 6 pet et upon a throne and be exalted high among m men 1 e n i yet lie has his temptations and blessed Is is ceif helf e if he endures them and is faithful to his trust tru ti I 1 arid arld an d if he be in distress bears it all with patience pat le ce kr he will always have his trials and r no person will escape all men must be t tried led aed and proven these arel are reflections that 0 occurred to to rn mind while br jackman Jac krman kraan addressed a us showing sh wag the contrast between those that first came hete bete and those who now come gorne I 1 was led to enquire why there was such a vast diffie difference rence and ind th thi thought occurred recurred to me nse that it was waa be bec because a auba aube experience for those who have been I 1 here I 1 e c e ir frol the first have been pretty well buffeted and b be e 1 fore they came here they had bad learned how 1 4 y 1 submit when the lord saw proper to putu autu put apoi them a chastisement i kat kaa should all this people peoples here in utah be call 11 to piss through guch such scenes as some come afus cf us ahry hava have been called upon to encounter I 1 beleve believe 1 thery h e would be many who would say latua et ilia naurl these things with all submission and nd pati piti ti enc before god in order to do this it is feces necessary ery form for foru vory vore s in prosperity our to remember the loid lord on gol god for if men and women will not remember the he lord when th the heavens smile upon them and when health is in their habitations if they will not acknowledge the hand of god then and be thankful for the blessings that they receive you may inay be sure that they will not be bp so well prepared to endure trials and ard to pass through adversities versi ties as those who have in the days of their prosperity humbled themselves before the lord and und acknowledged his hand in all things there are individuals in this territory of a careless dispo disposition and you may mark them and those that have ha ve waxed farind ther i her ber hearts are upon ahe things of orthis this world that when tribulations come they will be the ones unes to quake and fear while those who have taken a bifi different course will be able to stand I 1 heard br joseph when speaking of those that were sick sice in nauvoo make remarks similar to those that I 1 have now made he said that those who would not when in good health call upon the lord and acknowledge his hand in all things things and remember him would not have faith falth when it was needed he said that those individuals divi duals duala would have buver buttery but very jr little faith in the days of their calamities and affliction then seek to get faith and spirit sufficient to assist us in the days of our afflictions that we may be prepared for all the vicissitudes of life we ought to know that we are well off at the present but all nil do not realize this fact Ho how woften often I 1 hav have thought orthe of the remark made by the prophet nothing can be more true than that dat remark it carries its own evidence with it that those individuals who have wealth and riches in abundance but do not remember the lord when troubles come they will be in the greatest distress generally speaking I 1 doriot do not know what the lord will hereafter dau doi with this people I 1 have not myself a sufficiency of the spirit of prophecy to understand all the events of the future and I 1 doubt very much whether there is an individual in this church that does know krow but we do know as far as the things of the future are revealed and we may know many things by dreams and visions but when at it comes to principles and to what I 1 the lord will do with this people I 1 doubt very much whether there is s an individual in the world that knows the changes and variety of scenes through which this people will be called td to pass there are aarein in many revelations not only in modern but in ancient prophecy predictions touching the scenes of the last days and the trials trial of the saints and we ought to be prepared f for sor or whatever is to come troubles distress famine war or anything else the lord has said that great prosperity rity awaits ui us far beyond what we now have but bull I 1 doubt very much whether this prosperity will wilt come before we have passed th through Z some further tribulations there aire are revelations in n relation to the nations of the earth and this people that tha seem to indicate that we ve will have to pass through some things never have hive had t to 9 encounter and it seems se ems to me that we will have to stand forth and defend ourselves against our enemies and we have got to ge triet tried fag fas as Israel was and to vee see whether our sons will marry gentiles or our lighters lugh gentile husbands now aw if there were no gentiles among us we could not see whether there was any integrity amon amoni the people do you suppose that thi thit people will be kept away away from the gentiles no verily the lord does not intend that we should dwell separate from the world altogether from this time forth it is our duty to 0 o wa warn rn our sons song and daughters day by day and night by night and week by week as has been told us from this stand to warn our mir sons and daughters as god did our first parents concerning concerning the forbidden fruit when lie he set the forbid forbidden deil dell fruit before them he said if you eat it will make malit you mortal whereas you are now immortal but you may choose for yourselves now how do we know but when the gates of zion shall be open to the nations that the gentiles will come flocking in like a dowin flowing stream A flowing stream isone bisone is one that runs continually and the gentile gen tileo will in hat thit day come to ua us as a flowing stream and ana we shall have llave to set our gates ope open p continually they vl wall come as clouds and ind aidone As doves in large flocks do you suppose that the gentiles are going to be ignorant of what is taking place now this will not bs the case hey they will perfectly understand what is taking place the people will see that the hand of go goj is over this people they will see that lie he is jn in our midst and that he is our watch watchtower tower lower that he lie is our shield and our defence and therefore they will eay say let us u go up and put our riches in zion for there is no safety in our own nations those nations are arm trembling bling and tottering and will eventually crumble to ruin and those men of wealth will C come orrl orri here not to be baptized but many of them will come that have never heard the servants of f god but they tiley will hear that peace and health dwell among as and that our officers are all peace of ficera officer sand and our tax gath ebers men of righteousness they w will 11 come not to be baptized but they will come with their old traditions and customs and they will flee to zion with their riches but thy they will nome rome in favor of their old customs and of their old gentile notions of religion and ngod if god is merciful unto them so as to cause them to leave their native land that we may like them up and teach theland the mand nourish them and bring P them up to the jandard tan dard of truth bali ball all ali will be right butia they neglect to observe and gey obey bey the instructions given and to follow the rod god good examples set sot before them eo so much the greater |